If the dems woulda won


#1

if the dems woulda won…

minimum wage was proposed to be raised to $7 an hour. what good does this do other than temporary monetary satisfaction? none. it would have caused even worse inflation rates rasing the prices of oil in our country to match that of the u.k. at a wopping $4.15 a gallon. BAD

we would be an easy target for manipulation by enemies. kerry’s plans for peace with n. korea were unapproachable. n. korea woulda used this attempt of reconciliation to get on the u.s.a.'s “good side” so they could produce “nuclear power” (atomic and nuclear weapons) behind our backs. BAD

abortion in all cases would be legal, giving doctors and people of our future an easier way to capitalize- the killing of unborn people. BAD

social security would be left for the future to handle BAD

taxes would be laid more heavily on the rich ($100,000 a yr and up) and the others would have a relief. GOOD

prison overcrowding would be handled more efficiently with the release of many drug offenders from prison into rehab centers. GOOD

from what ive gathered, 4 bads and 2 goods. some of these issues are moral, however, so the bads and goods are about equal with them aside. basically, if kerry woulda won, our country would be in economic and global termoil.

flame away… :smiley:


#2

no use with the if’s except to start trouble.


#3

What if’s are always good… How do you think most of the present day conflicts were won on the battle field? How do you think most drug companies come up with breakthrough drugs? How do you think this site started???


#4

well WHAT IF someone just handed me 10 billion dollars for absolutely nothing?

that would be very cool.


#5

:popcorn


#6

Well, I think your heart is in the right place, so I hate to dis-agree with some of the stuff you said, BUT …

If Kerry had won, he would have been totally worthless as a Prez, not really because his politics or his personality, but because Congress is held by the good guys… er, I mean Republicans. They would have gone all childish on him like the Dems have on Bush. It’s what they (politicians) do.

The point about the minimum wage increasing is difficult to gauge. I think overall it would be a bad thing, but certainly not as world ending as you. Here in Cali it’s over that anyway.

The Prisoners going to rehab is B.S. IMHO. It’s just an easy out for them. I’m a big fan of doing hard time to fit the crime. If you steal something cheap and stupid, a few weeks should clean you up. You steal a car, take a year or two off your life. You rob houses for a living for a few years, and I think you should miss out on at least 8. Kill somebody in cold blood, to the chamber with you. Kill somebody because he broke into your house, you deserve a medal for saving the state punishment $$.

I do agree that he would have screwed the pooch w/ N.Korea though. It takes some real nuts of steel to play hardball with the Orientals. They work on a different mind-set than we do.

Great post to jump start the debates. :rock :rock


#7

nothing would be achieved for our country if kerry won b/c, like you said, the repubs have the congress. their would be veto after veto and no good would be achieved…


#8

[quote=AtlanticBlue99]if the dems woulda won…

minimum wage was proposed to be raised to $7 an hour. what good does this do other than temporary monetary satisfaction? none. it would have caused even worse inflation rates rasing the prices of oil in our country to match that of the u.k. at a wopping $4.15 a gallon. BAD

we would be an easy target for manipulation by enemies. kerry’s plans for peace with n. korea were unapproachable. n. korea woulda used this attempt of reconciliation to get on the u.s.a.'s “good side” so they could produce “nuclear power” (atomic and nuclear weapons) behind our backs. BAD

abortion in all cases would be legal, giving doctors and people of our future an easier way to capitalize- the killing of unborn people. BAD

social security would be left for the future to handle BAD

taxes would be laid more heavily on the rich ($100,000 a yr and up) and the others would have a relief. GOOD

prison overcrowding would be handled more efficiently with the release of many drug offenders from prison into rehab centers. GOOD

from what ive gathered, 4 bads and 2 goods. some of these issues are moral, however, so the bads and goods are about equal with them aside. basically, if kerry woulda won, our country would be in economic and global termoil.

flame away… :D[/quote]

:agree


#9

oh boy! I will dissect this thread as soon as I get back from lunch! but to start things off, you guys are weird as in :gay :rofl anyway brb


#10

you just had to go, so you can figure out more big words to put in it :slight_smile: :lol


#11

nah actually I did have lunch :fu


#12

[quote=AtlanticBlue99]if the dems woulda won…

minimum wage was proposed to be raised to $7 an hour. what good does this do other than temporary monetary satisfaction? none. it would have caused even worse inflation rates rasing the prices of oil in our country to match that of the u.k. at a wopping $4.15 a gallon. BAD

we would be an easy target for manipulation by enemies. kerry’s plans for peace with n. korea were unapproachable. n. korea woulda used this attempt of reconciliation to get on the u.s.a.'s “good side” so they could produce “nuclear power” (atomic and nuclear weapons) behind our backs. BAD

abortion in all cases would be legal, giving doctors and people of our future an easier way to capitalize- the killing of unborn people. BAD

social security would be left for the future to handle BAD

taxes would be laid more heavily on the rich ($100,000 a yr and up) and the others would have a relief. GOOD

prison overcrowding would be handled more efficiently with the release of many drug offenders from prison into rehab centers. GOOD

from what ive gathered, 4 bads and 2 goods. some of these issues are moral, however, so the bads and goods are about equal with them aside. basically, if kerry woulda won, our country would be in economic and global termoil.

flame away… :D[/quote]
Here is my stance on minimum wage: neither party is right. We should absolutely not raise the minimum wage 1 red cent at the moment. The only time we should raise the minimum wage is when unemployment is rediculously low (obviously not under republicans), almost to the point where it is bad. This is because when new employees become scarce companies will raise their salaries anyway to attract new employees, and keep their own employees from going to other companies, when this happens it is the opportune time to raise the minimum wage. Right now the unemployment rate is not at the magic number of 3% so we should sit still. Think of it this way, if you get paid $7.00 an hour right now and the congress changes the minimum wage to $6.50, the people getting minimum wage will now get that raise, but you won’t, so that makes you pissed especially if you have been at that company for a while.

  1. You can’t accurately say how it would happen or what would have happened if Kerry would have been elected because he wasn’t elected so you don’t know. Your side will of course say oh he would have done a terrible job, and my side would he would have done better than king george, but he wasn’t elected so who cares about how it could’ve turned out? :dunno We need friends, not enemies, and that seems like what Bush is doing, actively seeking enemies instead of trying to make friends (yes I know he went to Europe and put on a smile and a hand shake but do you really think him and chirac are friends? hahahaha no)

  2. Abortion really pisses me off, so I try to stay away from it. I am seriously pro-choice 100% (except partial-birth which is illegal anyways). You say unborn babies, but are they really independant living beings?? no. Yes they are living at a certain point, but take away the mom and it will die almost instantly, so therefore the mom can legally be more alive and more of a living being than the fetus inside of her, and should have the choice to abort the fetus before the third trimester. We can debate semantics all day long of what a “baby” is and when life begins, but all we are arguing is the definition of a word, and what it means to different people. I think the anti-abortion movement has a lot to do with the christian right, who I think are assholes. SEPERATION OF CHURCH AND STATE. Because God loves the fetus is not a LEGAL reason to reverse Roe v. Wade. Neither is the fact that the bible supposedly doesn’t like Gays. The bible should never be referenced or used in politics ever! I am a Lutheran, I believe in God, and I am an active participant in my church, but the two don’t mix at all. Bush is giving millions to church organizations, and I bet you my favorite shot glass he doesn’t give any money to muslim organizations throughout the country, now he is violatiing the constitution by not not protecting freedom of religion. The state cannot support one religion and not the other, because by the constitution all religions in this country are equal, you give to one, you give the same to all, even satanic worshippers.

  3. Social security is another hot issue. President Bush’s plan will require the nation to borrow 5 trillion dollars, on top of the hundreds of billion we already owe, to implement it. This debt will be bought by Japan, S. Korea, and the Middle East, meaning until this fucking huge debt is paid off those countries own us. Now do you want to be owned by Saudi Arabia?? I thought you guys didn’t like them? I don’t know exactly what to do, but I know the retirement age needs to be raised (people are living longer and healthier) and that people who make over 90k a year need to pay more not just a set amount, to help lift the burden on people who make less and draw a lot. Privatizing will make the rich richer and the poor poorer. I can work the stock market so let me do it on my own. For someone who doesn’t know the markets they will have to pay more to have someone do it for them, thereby losing money. This statistically will hurt women and minorities the most. This plan will bring hundreds of billions to Wall Street and will help massive brokerage houses make a lot of money and so they get rich while we get poor. Also who will do the managing? Is the government prepared to become the nations only free brokerage house? Or will we have to pay a fee each time we make a transaction? That would really suck, because right there you lose money you are trying to save, and it adds up quick.

  4. Taxes, yes they should be more on the rich, and someday hopefully I will be classified in the over 100k a year, and I will gladly pay my damn share because understand the importance of taxes and if you make more you give more, simple.

  5. The prison thing. Yeah what someone else said, I think tim? if a person jacks a video tape they get a couple weeks, jack a car a year or two etc… killing they get the chair if they absolutely proved guilty and there is no other possible explanation except they were the killer. Drug people should be sent to rehab, although that brings in more cost issues.

This is perhaps the longest post I have ever typed in my life, and my fingers are close to bleeding. That’s where I stand on many issues. I think you guys are backwards you may think I’m backwards, but at least we like mustangs… :rock


#13

yep… atleast we all agree on mustangs. :slight_smile:


#14

for #3, when the baby is alive or dead is a huge debate between different scientists, some who are theistic, and some who arent. either way, it is a moral debate.

we all can find things we agree and disagree on, but just throwing out some ideas of what it could be like with kerry in office and the dems in power of congress. he is far left- a little too far left for america imo.

bottom line, to achieve anything beneficial and get what is best for everyone, we need middle of the road people running for office and an optimistic look at the future


#15

[quote=AtlanticBlue99]for #3, when the baby is alive or dead is a huge debate between different scientists, some who are theistic, and some who arent. either way, it is a moral debate.

we all can find things we agree and disagree on, but just throwing out some ideas of what it could be like with kerry in office and the dems in power of congress. he is far left- a little too far left for america imo.

bottom line, to achieve anything beneficial and get what is best for everyone, we need middle of the road people running for office and an optimistic look at the future[/quote]

Well like I used to say on MF I wouldn’t want to see either party control everything at once, that is not healthy for the nation, it needs to be a mix, and we need more people like Russ Fiengold (D-Wisconsin) and John McCain (R-Arizona) to work bipartisan to get things done.


#16

100% agreed :rock


#17

Now I need a raincheck. Mac, you and I have had our fair share of good healthy debates. The big post you made up there does sound good, but you didn’t do your homework fully. Is that shot glass really up for grabs? :smiley:

I’ll be back on after work so I have time to write. :rock :rock


#18

I agree.


#19

[quote=IntruderLS1]Now I need a raincheck. Mac, you and I have had our fair share of good healthy debates. The big post you made up there does sound good, but you didn’t do your homework fully. Is that shot glass really up for grabs? :smiley:

I’ll be back on after work so I have time to write. :rock :rock[/quote]

Nah, I should’ve used a better example like satan worshippers or something. I did a little more research and I will send it to you if you find evidence he allocates the same amount of money to ALL religions.


#20

I laugh when I hear this democracts this republican thing fuck that shit… fighting between parties they have us fighting over this bullshit as we don’t see the whole picture they are all robbing us blind! have a national sales tax you make more,you spend more,you pay more tax…couldn’t be any more fair than that huh?