Is God competent or incompetent?


#41

1Peter 1:20 0 He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.

If that is not God setting the stage for the murder of Jesus then ---------

Regards
DL


#42

Chosen does not refer to chosen for death.

Besides, your verse says nothing of his apparent murder.


#43

Go read the text instead of making idiotic statements.

If not death then tell us what for.

Regards
DL


#44

Neither in my opinion, if there was a god he either died sparking the big bang or never existed to begin with.


#45

No argument, but I was seeking opinions on what is shown in the bible as literature.

Regards
DL


#46

Why do you want to blame God if you believe that he doesn’t exist?


#47

If we go by YOUR way, if you do not believe in god and you don’t think that he exists, then why do you blame VOID?


#48

I do not and cannot blame what does not exist.

I can judge what is said of the supernatural satanic God portrayed in scriptures?

How do you see that bible God if not as a satanic and vile God?

Regards
DL


#49

Hey :blush:

As far as I know from my Christian religion studies loooong ago in school --> We were made in the image of God, respectively, he created us as his dead ringer. For myself, I don’t believe in this fairy tale. Humanity always wanted to feel special and asked itself why we can think and have an awareness of the self – so the humans said through history: We are part of something bigger – maybe a higher species.
The result is that in the bible we are God’s dead ringer and God is a man, because of some overconfident old men.
And now the reason, why I have told you that: We have made God. And to understand him, we humanized him --> He does failures and some how in the eye of the bible they were a right choice and humanity decided wrong or he wanted to punish humanity, but it was a “correct” punishment.

You see, God is as incompetent or competent as we are. Ask the Greek mythology, they have done the same, but far aware.

So yes “God” is incompetent.

And to incidentally add, look at all the religions – they are all the same – Why oh why :wink:

(This is my opinion of religion and I admit that I didn’t read the following comments - so if I insult someone - sorry, but religion can never be a debate about right and wrong, because it is personal. So don’t stop believing just except my comment.)

Best regards,

Wannabe


#50

Thanks for your well thought out post.

I disagree with the quoted part.

Most reveled religions put God above man.

Some Eastern religions like Buddhism and my own Gnostic Christian religion, like you it sounds like, put man above God where we belong. After all, we create all our Gods.

Regards
DL


#51

I don’t really reference anything other than the Hermetic Corpus for my idea of God, and in there man is God’s brother. I like Leibniz’s preservation of God’s goodness, though. In Leibniz’s ‘Discourse on Metaphysics’, they attribute god’s goodness to god’s perfection. This could mean god is amoral. God’s creation is done in such a way that the most perfect ends are reached by the most simplistic of means. Of course, Leibniz is the igniter to the whole “best of all possible worlds” idea. The main idea is that god determined that the best of all possible worlds is one that includes creatures in which evil, or imperfection, is conatural to them. “lesser evil is relatively good, so a lesser good is relatively evil.” To say that the best possible world is without evil would be to say that we would not exist if this were the best possible world. Leibniz holds that. God is good in his perfection. God has perfectly determined a world with us rather than one without us, and therefore a perfect God certainly would create a world where evil exists.

IDK, I liked Leibniz’s Discourse for the subject-predicate relationship. If I were to make enough assumptions of God to the point where I can judge their competence, I’d follow Leibniz’s model.


#52

Interesting and I think we are on the same page on this.

Have a look at what I give to some when they have read what Christianity, basically, says of our hate of matter and the world.

Gnostic Christian Jesus said, “If those who attract you say, ‘See, the Kingdom is in the sky,’ then the birds of the sky will precede you.
If they say to you, ‘It is under the earth,’ then the fish of the sea will precede you.
Rather, the Kingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you.
[Those who] become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] become acquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are the sons of the living Father.
But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty.”

As you can see from that quote, if we see God’s kingdom all around us and inside of us, we cannot think that the world is anything but evolving perfection. Most just don’t see it and live in poverty. Let me try to make you see the world the way I do.

Here is a mind exercise. Tell me what you see when you look around. The best that can possibly be or an ugly and imperfect world?

Candide.
"It is demonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end.”

That means that we live in the best of all possible worlds, given all the conditions at hand and the history that got us here. That is an irrefutable statement given entropy and the anthropic principle.

Regards
DL


#53

Honestly, if god does exist I imagine he’s just experimenting. Think of it: he has virtually limitless power. He’s bored. He’s just dicking around to keep himself entertained. Its like with Dr. Manhattan from Watchmen. It’s also kinda like a kid taking a worm and putting it near an ant hill to observe what happens. There’s no stakes for the overseer, just entertainment.


#54

I follow the first part of what you said. I really enjoy Alan Watt’s interpretations on this. My favorite is if you can dream anything you want, you’d eventually reach a point where you would dream something in which you do not know is going to happen to you. You would come up with all sorts of variables, and eventually you’d find yourself dreaming of where you are now.

As for your interpretation, that makes a lot of sense. What if the experiment is to have stakes? What if the experiment this time is to put yourself into meat, and you’re god in the perspective of yourself? I’ve been on trippy shit like this for years.


#55

That is why I say that if God ever pops us, I will try to kill him.

It is also why I laugh at those who say they want to live eternally. It would be so boring that we would all wish for death.

Regards
DL


#56

I prefer ribs.

Regards
DL


#57

He is neither competent nor incompetent for he does not exist; he is a human construct.


#58

Deists mocked theology before it was cool. But no the Christian conception of god is little more then fantasy, the universe follows rationale laws rather consistently and constantly, the Christian god actively breaks his own creations rules arbitrarily and encourages you to disengage your higher reasoning, when you inherit it from the universe’s laws naturally


#59

God must clearly be more competent than we are if he was to have created the universe. We are created in his image, that is not the same as being created exactly the same as him.

Er, no they are not. Even the Abrahamic religions are distinct in their theology, and, to an extent their worldview.

I am not familiar with the gospel of “Gnostic Christian Jesus,” if this is a part of the Christian Scriptures then could you please enlighten me as to the location of this text?

I would like to see that.

What is boring about wanting to spend an eternity free from mortality? Spending eternity full of joy, and peace?

What do you base this argument on?

If he created those rules, can he not beak them?

No it doesn’t. You don’t put on an idiot hat when you become a believer. I would note also that your “higher reasoning” has led to the murder of millions.


#60

Your beliefs led to the justification of the virtual enslavement of almost the entirety of Europe for centuries to feudalism and the Catholic Church, your kill count dwarfs that of any world view that attempts to build itself rationally, not to mention the genocides and purges that the religious like to do with their counterparts, my own ethnicity was ethnically cleansed because of religion.