Is the need of salvation an evil lie from religions?


#61

[QUOTE=“Samuel, post: 2682779, member: 9634”]Define to me what is evil? Because definitions of this term can and does change as humanity marches forward. Killing people because they were a different religion, or you suspected them of being an atheist or a witch was good before, and now is evil. Tell me how a thing that is completely relative have such an absolute definition to you? I do not consider rape evil either. Because doing so is foolish. And what I mean by that is, that right or wrong do not exist. You put the label on an action or reaction you see fit or well damn please. That is only valuable to you and you alone. Many people share your views, but understand that they mean nothing.[/QUOTE]

By refusing to accept common views, you have painted yourself into a corner. Here is the proof.

If our views mean nothing, why are you giving us your meaningless views?

Regards
DL


#62

[QUOTE=“Ricky, post: 2682783, member: 2996”]I’ve found that there is little difference between the faith of the religious and the faith of supposedly secular philosophical adherents. But at least the latter claim to adhere to the principle of rationalism, whereas the former often pride themselves in their rejection of it.[/QUOTE]

I hear you and agree.

Regards
DL


#63

[QUOTE=“owainp, post: 2682857, member: 4544”]So there is no truth to what they believe? Then why believe them, or [I]anything else[/I], for that matter?[/QUOTE]

Now why would you twist what I said to something I did not say?

I did not say there was no truth in their beliefs. I said no religion is the one true religion.

I stand by what I said. Not by what you interpreted what I said with your twist added.

Think as the ancients did my friend. That is the intelligent way to go.

[URL]http://bigthink.com/videos/what-is-god-2-2[/URL]

Regards
DL


#64

[QUOTE=“Greatest I am, post: 2682869, member: 15351”]By refusing to accept common views, you have painted yourself into a corner. Here is the proof.

If our views mean nothing, why are you giving us your meaningless views?

Regards
DL[/QUOTE]

The same reason you give your meaningless views. Because you can.


#65

[QUOTE=“Samuel, post: 2682875, member: 9634”]The same reason you give your meaningless views. Because you can.[/QUOTE]

Sure, but I do not think them meaningless while you do.

That is really unintelligent on your part while possibly being only naivety on mine.

Regards
DL


#66

[QUOTE=“Greatest I am, post: 2682888, member: 15351”]Sure, but I do not think them meaningless while you do.

That is really unintelligent on your part while possibly being only naivety on mine.

Regards
DL[/QUOTE]

Goes back to relativity. Your views are not meaningless to you, my views are not to me. But I wouldn’t shun anybody (like you were trying to do) because they think differently than me. That was my main point.


#67

[QUOTE=“Greatest I am, post: 2682872, member: 15351”]Now why would you twist what I said to something I did not say?

I did not say there was no truth in their beliefs. I said no religion is the one true religion.

I stand by what I said. Not by what you interpreted what I said with your twist added.[/QUOTE]
And how do you [I]know[/I] there is no one true religion? Most religions claim absolute truth, as does Christianity. If none of them are absolutely true, then they must be wrong. But is it not possible that one religion does have the truth?

[QUOTE=“Greatest I am, post: 2682872, member: 15351”]Think as the ancients did my friend. That is the intelligent way to go.[/QUOTE]
Why? They are, well, ancient, and much of their wisdom is not applicable to us in our age. One of the reasons Christianity makes sense to me is that its relevance is timeless- it is as relevant now as it was 2000 years ago.


#68

[QUOTE=“owainp, post: 2682971, member: 4544”]And how do you [I]know[/I] there is no one true religion? Most religions claim absolute truth, as does Christianity. If none of them are absolutely true, then they must be wrong. But is it not possible that one religion does have the truth?

[B]All religions are ate tribal units. One cannot say that one tribe is more true than another. They are all true tribes. So to speak.

It could be said that some have better theologies than some other but that is a comparison and not a truth versus a non-truth.[/B]

Why? They are, well, ancient, and much of their wisdom is not applicable to us in our age. One of the reasons Christianity makes sense to me is that its relevance is timeless- it is as relevant now as it was 2000 years ago.[/QUOTE]

Why? They are, well, ancient, and much of their wisdom is not applicable to us in our age. One of the reasons Christianity makes sense to me is that its relevance is timeless- it is as relevant now as it was 2000 years ago.

[B]Soooo, why is your respect for the ancients ok and valid while mine is not?

I just get mine from various ancient text while you are just evaluating one.

Regards
DL[/B]


#69

[QUOTE=“owainp, post: 2682971, member: 4544”]
it is as relevant now as it was 2000 years ago.[/QUOTE]

If that is true, then why do you think it ok to stone unruly children and fornicators?

Regards
DL


#70

[QUOTE=“Greatest I am, post: 2683088, member: 15351”]If that is true, then why do you think it ok to stone unruly children and fornicators?

Regards
DL[/QUOTE]
When the hell did I say this was ok? Like anything else, know your context and [I]definitely[/I] don’t generalise.


#71

[QUOTE=“owainp, post: 2683135, member: 4544”]When the hell did I say this was ok? Like anything else, know your context and [I]definitely[/I] don’t generalise.[/QUOTE]

You said it was relevant to today and the main part of any religion is the laws or commandments it gives.

If you did not mean those, what did you mean?

Regards
DL


#72

[QUOTE=“Greatest I am, post: 2683235, member: 15351”]main part of any religion is the laws or commandments it gives.[/QUOTE]
That’s not what Jesus said. Yes, he said “I have come not to abolish the laws but to fulfil them”, but this does not make the laws the [I]most important[/I] part of the faith. [I]Jesus[/I] is the most important part.

[QUOTE=“Greatest I am, post: 2683235, member: 15351”]If you did not mean those, what did you mean?[/QUOTE]
Obviously context, traditions etc change over large periods of time. You can’t expect Christians to act and talk as they did 2000 years ago, the world has changed. What I meant was that many of the teachings of Jesus for example are universal truths, truths that remain so even over a change in time. For example, “Love your neighbour as yourself” is a teaching that is as relevant today as it was when Jesus taught it. We need to make a distinction between moral truth and culture.


#73

Correct, and that cannot be done by the faithful that believe in ghosts and supernatural witches.

To make the distinction you want, you have to use logic and reason and those are in the natural realm and not the supernatural and impossible to know realm that you count on.

Your own scriptures tell you not to do that but you ignore that inconvenient truth.

Regards
DL


#74

I don’t like the fact that religions make a large point of salvation and often a coming apocalypse, this view of most churches is pretty evil. I don’t hate religion like DL does, however I do accept that most of the old views (other than the point of having strong family units) are pretty outdated and do harm the perceptions of individuals within the church.


#75

I am more fundamental to morality than religiosity or tribalism.

I let the dislike I had turn to hate at the same time as I learned to truly love. It is something that cannot be helped.

Regards
DL


#76

Hell yea, a true nihilist right there.


#77

Can you read. I described the opposite.

Use smaller words as you might be confusing yourself.

Regards
DL


#78

The idea that the individual is more fundamental to morality than an outside man-made religion is, one not a bad thing, and two a concept that Nietzsche put forth. You must build your own system of morality rather than attach yourself to a already existing one.
My comment was not an insult, most followers of Nietzsche identify as nihilists. You should read up on some philosophy, you might be in the dark on this one.


#79

I ignore no “truth” in the Scriptures that I know and accept.


#80

Why bother with morals at all if they see no meaning to life?

Regards
DL